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Tv show investigates Rich Dad Seminars..

RCrein

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QUOTE (cailmoney @ Jan 31 2010, 08:49 PM) Anyone who has been to a rich dad seminar will definitely relate to this video.

http://www.cbc.ca/marketplace/2010/road_to...h_dad/main.html


Watched the show Friday. It was about as damning a critique as one could imagine. Hidden camera showed pressure tactics to upsell up to $40,000 more in "advanced" courses. "Instructors" stories were shown to be grossly exaggerated or outright fictitious. Fun to watch but I felt sorry for the victims. Great to have a forum like this to help watch out for these operators.

The info new to me was that Robert K had licensced his name to another company to operate these "seminars". He didn`t come off as the sharpest knife in the drawer in his discussion of the probelms he has had trying to manage his licenscee. Either he is dumb, niave and ill-advised or has been corrupted by the money.
 

Gen1GT

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I watched the show on Friday night, and I feel it was a horrible piece of journalism with weak understanding of the topic, poor excuses for “victims,” and a stubborn mission to crucify Rich Dad above the truth. Anyone who has read any Rich Dad material knows what Robert Kiyosaki is really about, and he’s way too intelligent a business man to run a scam. The Rich Dad education system is a licensed product. Robert doesn’t run the programs. I don’t know much about the Whitney program, but it appears to be less well run than the other one in Canada, Tigrent Learning. If you went to a McDonald’s in India and thought the place was a dump and you found a hair in your Big Mac, would you complain to Ray Croc?



I went to the $500 3-day seminar hosted by Tigrent learning in Hamilton a few weeks ago. It was, without a doubt, the best $500 I’ve ever spent in my life. Our instructor was a great guy named “Pip.” We learned a ton of the basics of real estate investing, covering enough topics that it’s enabled me to focus my energy on further education, even if it’s not with Rich Dad. Not only did I get 3 days worth of training, I got a real estate textbook with great info plus various Rich Dad materials which keep in line with his how to be Rich philosophy. The program is so much more than just how to do real estate. The Rich Dad program emphasizes other aspects you won’t see at a regular seminar. They teach you to hire fantastic team members, such as lawyers, accountants, brokers and agents etc. They teach you asset protection, financial awareness, non-real estate investment teachings etc. I also got books on accounting, financial statements, etc, in addition to a 12 CD set which is great to listen to in the car since I have a long commute. I also got Kiyosaki’s Financial IQ book. All of that for $500?? I would have paid $500 for all the books and CD’s. Anyone that has taken any sort of education knows how much value there is in getting that much for that little cost.



I haven’t even done my first real estate transaction, but it’s already changed my life. I have more drive and passion, I’ve set lofty goals for myself and because of massive amount I’ve learned already, a real estate agent asked me what financial institution I worked for (even though I work in an engineering field). I wouldn’t have found this forum if it wasn’t for Rich Dad. I read Rich Dad Poor Dad last year, and since then, I’ve got my finances under control, we budget our money, we save $200/week for savings/investing/charities. I’ve lowered interest rates on our credit cards while increasing their limits.



Just like any other education system, not everyone gets the same out of it. The problem with persons like the woman and man interviewed on Marketplace, is that they thought it was going to be a get rich quick program. It’s not. It’s a system they’re selling. I didn’t buy into their system, because I’m one of those individuals that excels at self-learning. There’s no doubt that anyone doing the courses won’t be successful. No doubt at all. I just know I can be successful without it, so I’m going to learn what I can with the wealth of information that’s available these days. I already have a real estate agent working for me, multiple sources of private money lined up, a great lawyer that can take care of everything from real estate transactions to our 3 tier corporation and asset protection.



It’s sad that our media is so obsessed with reporting everything that’s negative. This ignorant journalist either didn’t do her homework to see how many successful and happy persons there were going through the program, or she just didn’t want to ruin her pseudo-exposé. It’s no problem though. If everyone is going to stay away from Rich Dad education now, then it means there is fewer competition for me! Haha.
 

thejules

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The difficult thing about these guys and other seminar producers is that they make thier money selling courses and seminars & they do not do what they teach. If you are able to do some digging - you`ll find out that these companies make very little money at all, hense that hard sell.

As has been said before, find out if the teacher you`re learning from does what he/she is teaching you to do. Does this person eat thier own cooking?

That`s why I love and continue to stay loyal to the REIN Group and the teachings of Don R. Campbell. He is and they are the real deal!
 

gwasser

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QUOTE (Gen1GT @ Feb 1 2010, 07:28 AM) I watched the show on Friday night, and I feel it was a horrible piece of journalism with weak understanding of the topic, poor excuses for "victims," and a stubborn mission to crucify Rich Dad above the truth.
Although I am not a fan of CBC, here I felt they did a super job. The hidden camera work illustrated clearly that we were dealing with a scam and participant intimidation on a level beyond believe.

QUOTE Anyone who has read any Rich Dad material knows what Robert Kiyosaki is really about, and he`s way too intelligent a business man to run a scam.
I have had doubts about Rober Kiyosaki`s business acumen from the moment I read in one of his earlier books his definition of a `super investor` which was someone who dabbles in private placements for junior oil companies. In those days you could buy yourself control into a junior oil company for as little as $40K. Also, he has a history of bad business partners and went bankrupt before. He considered having a million in net assets as a sign of tremendous success. Excuse me!
QUOTE The Rich Dad education system is a licensed product. Robert doesn`t run the programs. I don`t know much about the Whitney program, but it appears to be less well run than the other one in Canada, Tigrent Learning. If you went to a McDonald`s in India and thought the place was a dump and you found a hair in your Big Mac, would you complain to Ray Croc?
You bet Ray Croc is responsible for McDonald`s in India. He sells the franchise and he owes it to other franchisees who put up a lot of money to buy a McDonald`s franchise that the quality and services are consistent throughout the world. That Robert Kiyosaki could not enforce his franchise or licensing conditions in Canada with Darren Weeks shows his incompetence whatever his motivation.

Don`t tell me that he does not owe allegiance to the people that forked out $25K or more to learn from his franchise. Every one of their ads shows Kiyosaki smiling besides Darren Weeks. Don`t tell me those guys don`t make money at those outrageous fees. I feel for their victims, although they were gullible, in fact many were gullible enough that they tried to increase their credit card limit to $100,000. Boy how stupid can you get!

People claim to be adults and that they can make their own decisions. Next you see them increasing their credit card limits to absurd levels and forking out $25K plus for courses and mentorships, then I really wonder. Some of you may have done those things and call me an `arrogant b....tard` for pointing this out. But ladies and gentlemen, unfortunately, I am right and sometimes it hurts to be pointed out the obvious.
 

Savard

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In Calgary, the Rich Dad franchise sells the save tax scam. fight aids, save taxes or F.A.S.T.
Clearly, the Rich Dad organization promotes investmesnts that will harm the investor and benefit the salesperson.
 

Gen1GT

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QUOTE (gwasser @ Feb 1 2010, 10:48 AM) Although I am not a fan of CBC, here I felt they did a super job. The hidden camera work illustrated clearly that we were dealing with a scam and participant intimidation on a level beyond believe.


I have had doubts about Rober Kiyosaki`s business acumen from the moment I read in one of his earlier books his definition of a `super investor` which was someone who dabbles in private placements for junior oil companies. In those days you could buy yourself control into a junior oil company for as little as $40K. Also, he has a history of bad business partners and went bankrupt before. He considered having a million in net assets as a sign of tremendous success. Excuse me!

You bet Ray Croc is responsible for McDonald`s in India. He sells the franchise and he owes it to other franchisees who put up a lot of money to buy a McDonald`s franchise that the quality and services are consistent throughout the world. That Robert Kiyosaki could not enforce his franchise or licensing conditions in Canada with Darren Weeks shows his incompetence whatever his motivation.

Don`t tell me that he does not owe allegiance to the people that forked out $25K or more to learn from his franchise. Every one of their ads shows Kiyosaki smiling besides Darren Weeks. Don`t tell me those guys don`t make money at those outrageous fees. I feel for their victims, although they were gullible, in fact many were gullible enough that they tried to increase their credit card limit to $100,000. Boy how stupid can you get!

People claim to be adults and that they can make their own decisions. Next you see them increasing their credit card limits to absurd levels and forking out $25K plus for courses and mentorships, then I really wonder. Some of you may have done those things and call me an `arrogant b....tard` for pointing this out. But ladies and gentlemen, unfortunately, I am right and sometimes it hurts to be pointed out the obvious.

Yes, you are definitely sounding arrogant; I’m glad you pointed it out before I did. It’s almost like you didn’t even read my post. You have formed your own opinion of the nature of the universe, and I’m not sure anything I can say will change that. Your personal opinion of his business decisions isn’t going to make him any less successful, and your personal opinions aren’t going to change the fact he has helped a lot of people.



Are you honestly going to tell me you’ve never happy crappy service at a crappy looking McDonald’s? I sure have, and after my experience, I didn’t consider contacting Ray Croc. If Robert Kiyosaki developed a system and licensed it out, I’m 100% sure he wants it to succeed. However, because he has licensed this in Brazil, the US, Canada, Europe and Australia, he can’t be in all places at all times. He stresses using other people’s time and other people’s money. If he’s spending his time dealing with a small conflict in little ol’ Cambridge, then he’s obviously not leveraging his time very well.

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Your point about the $100,000 credit card limit shows how little you and the journalist know what you’re talking about. They tell you to ask for 100 G’s, because they expect you to ask for a lot and get a little. It’s the same thing as low balling on a property offer. Ask for a lot, and get a little. If they say yes to your first request, then you left money on the table. After the first day of my seminar, I called and got my card limit raised and had my interest rate lowered. How can anyone possibly find a problem in having a better credit score, more available credit and a lower interest rate? I didn’t use it to pay for their advanced courses, because like I said, I am capable enough to learn this stuff on my own. However, also like I said before, anyone that paid for these advanced courses will more than likely not be disappointed. People spend WAY more than $12,000-45,000 on their educations, and only a fraction of a percentage of those people will make more than you can make in real estate.



So tell me…how are you “right” on subjective topic?
 

koop

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QUOTE (gwasser @ Feb 1 2010, 09:48 AM) Some of you may have done those things and call me an `arrogant b....tard` for pointing this out. But ladies and gentlemen, unfortunately, I am right and sometimes it hurts to be pointed out the obvious.

I agree with you, it seems these are programs that just feed on the greedy, and the pressure makes it a feeding frenzy.
I went to one of those high pressure "free" seminars, when my wife and I walked out we learned an important lesson that evening, to be able to sit in the hot seat and still say NO.

I still like Rich Dad Poor Dad, and Robert`s ideas, but I wouldn`t put money into anything having his name on it. Roberts ideas reshaped my ideas of how look at money, and got me interested in RE.
 

Mecheng

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Defiantly this report shows this as nothing more than a pressured sales pitch. However, some say that they did get value out of the course.
Having not taken the course here is my question: Would a beginner be able to confidently purchase their first property after this course?

They mention some books and CD`s so notwithstanding the up-sales tactics of this particular trainer, if this is the case then surly there is some value in the course. So is the complaint that the course has "no value", or that the sales tactics were just not appreciated? And was it just this trainer or the course in general?

Isn`t $500/$600 for a getting started program reasonable? (REIN Quick Start) (assuming most people at these courses are beginners)
I agree you may spend up to $40K over a life time of being a RE investor and lots of people spend more than this on college or university educations.
However, pressuring people to spend this up front seems ridicules. Do people actually think they need to know every RE strategies in existence before they can even get started?

I don`t see any problem with spending < $1K to learn how to get started. If you want to continue as a RE investor, then look into some advanced courses. Purchase them as you need too not becuse some sales guy told you to (doesn`t logic kick in hear?). But if you have $40K to spend, buy a property (or two) with it and for god sakes don`t put it on your credit card, if you think finding cash flowing properties with 2-5% on a LOC is hard imagine paying 18-28%. How could anyone hear that advice and not have alarm bells go off?
 

gwasser

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QUOTE (Gen1GT @ Feb 1 2010, 11:21 AM) So tell me…how are you "right" on subjective topic?

Yes, you are definitely sounding arrogant; I`m glad you pointed it out before I did. It`s almost like you didn`t even read my post. You have formed your own opinion of the nature of the universe, and I`m not sure anything I can say will change that. Your personal opinion of his business decisions isn`t going to make him any less successful, and your personal opinions aren`t going to change the fact he has helped a lot of people.
I have based my personal opinion on the data I have read and heard as well as on my personal experience as an investor. (I read a number of his books, I saw his ads and I didn`t want to touch them with a 10 foot pole - call that what you want). Yes his first book was good and others were OK and a lot of people learned from it. That doesn`t jusify the rest.

QUOTE Are you honestly going to tell me you`ve never happy crappy service at a crappy looking McDonald`s? I sure have, and after my experience, I didn`t consider contacting Ray Croc. If Robert Kiyosaki developed a system and licensed it out, I`m 100% sure he wants it to succeed. However, because he has licensed this in Brazil, the US, Canada, Europe and Australia, he can`t be in all places at all times. He stresses using other people`s time and other people`s money. If he`s spending his time dealing with a small conflict in little ol` Cambridge, then he`s obviously not leveraging his time very well.
Regarding getting crappy service at McDonalds. No I never did, not even in Jakarta. Not in Holland or in other places I went. The quality of their burgers is not great but then you get what your pay for. Yes, Ray Croc is responsible and if McDonald`s did not meet customer`s expectations his earnings would decline and he would definitely be held responsible by the shareholders as well as that he would lose marketshare and sell less franchises. He and his company could and would be taken to court by shareholders, by angry franchisees and by sick customers. Remember the case of the scalded coffee? Remember the obesity lawsuit?
QUOTE
Your point about the $100,000 credit card limit shows how little you and the journalist know what you`re talking about. They tell you to ask for 100 G`s, because they expect you to ask for a lot and get a little. It`s the same thing as low balling on a property offer. Ask for a lot, and get a little. If they say yes to your first request, then you left money on the table. After the first day of my seminar, I called and got my card limit raised and had my interest rate lowered. How can anyone possibly find a problem in having a better credit score, more available credit and a lower interest rate? I didn`t use it to pay for their advanced courses, because like I said, I am capable enough to learn this stuff on my own. However, also like I said before, anyone that paid for these advanced courses will more than likely not be disappointed. People spend WAY more than $12,000-45,000 on their educations, and only a fraction of a percentage of those people will make more than you can make in real estate.

I saw on the videos what happened. I have heard similar testimony from others. And even if you raised your limit to $45,000 who in their right mind would use a credit card for a downpayment on a real estate property. If you were that underfunded you should not go into real estate. Just common sense. Furthermore if you need a $500 real estate course to learn how to increase your credit card limit and lower your interest, then I have a bridge for sale in Manhattan. Normally one goes to a bank clerk for that and that doesn`t cost you $500.

I bet that you don`t like to hear that either and you want to call me `arrogant` again? (Ain`t I feisty today?)
 

fumbrunner

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QUOTE (Gen1GT @ Feb 1 2010, 12:21 PM) [/size]

Your point about the $100,000 credit card limit shows how little you and the journalist know what you`re talking about. They tell you to ask for 100 G`s, because they expect you to ask for a lot and get a little. It`s the same thing as low balling on a property offer. Ask for a lot, and get a little. If they say yes to your first request, then you left money on the table. After the first day of my seminar, I called and got my card limit raised and had my interest rate lowered. How can anyone possibly find a problem in having a better credit score, more available credit and a lower interest rate? I didn`t use it to pay for their advanced courses, because like I said, I am capable enough to learn this stuff on my own. However, also like I said before, anyone that paid for these advanced courses will more than likely not be disappointed. People spend WAY more than $12,000-45,000 on their educations, and only a fraction of a percentage of those people will make more than you can make in real estate.



So tell me…how are you "right" on subjective topic?

You are using credit cards to purchase properties? Yikes! I am afraid of HELOC rates, never mind credit card rates.
 

KevinMatwichuk

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I have attended the 3 day Rich Dad seminar in Edmonton. Unfortunately it was almost exactly as reported by Market Place. I`m still a fan for Robert K. but I think he needs to manage is brand better.

REIN ROCKS!!
 

bizaro86

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Ray Croc died in 1984, so you`d have a heck of a time complaining to him.

However, he absolutely would have responded to an issue in one of the restaurants. He cared about the brand being consistent, because otherwise it would have no value.

Imagine if you went to McDonalds once a week for a month, and each time it was different. One location only served bagels, one was a sit-down white tablecloth steakhouse, the next one was a roadside taco stand, etc. You`d be extremely confused as to what the brand was supposed to mean, and likely wouldn`t continue to go back. McDonalds isn`t fine dining, but its definitely consistent.

Kiyosaki has the "Rich Dad" brand, which he has licensed to people who are using it to separate investors from their money with hard-sell seminar pitches. This TV expose is just the natural fallout for not keeping control and consistency in the brand.

I also wondered about his "pilgrimage" in the book to convince someone to allow him to invest in small private oil and mining companies. In my experience the promotors of these companies are always looking for new investors.

Michael
 

KevinMatwichuk

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QUOTE (bizaro86 @ Feb 1 2010, 01:53 PM) Ray Croc died in 1984, so you`d have a heck of a time complaining to him.

However, he absolutely would have responded to an issue in one of the restaurants. He cared about the brand being consistent, because otherwise it would have no value.

Imagine if you went to McDonalds once a week for a month, and each time it was different. One location only served bagels, one was a sit-down white tablecloth steakhouse, the next one was a roadside taco stand, etc. You`d be extremely confused as to what the brand was supposed to mean, and likely wouldn`t continue to go back. McDonalds isn`t fine dining, but its definitely consistent.

Kiyosaki has the "Rich Dad" brand, which he has licensed to people who are using it to separate investors from their money with hard-sell seminar pitches. This TV expose is just the natural fallout for not keeping control and consistency in the brand.

I also wondered about his "pilgrimage" in the book to convince someone to allow him to invest in small private oil and mining companies. In my experience the promotors of these companies are always looking for new investors.

Michael


I`ve been to McDonalds in China, Mexico City, Puerto Rico, and several other places around the world. The quality, consistancy of service, and marketing message is always the same.
 

Gen1GT

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I don`t know where using credit cards to pay for real estate down payments came from, because that wasn`t the point of raising the credit card limits. There were no suprises. They want you to pay for your seminars with your credit card, and they tell you that on day one.

Once again, it appears that nobody is even reading my posts, because nobody is making the distinction that these courses are not held by Rich Dad, but are licensed to private educators. The one I went to, was held by Tigrent Learning, not Whitney. Can we all imagine for a second that these $500 seminars may be different because of this? Our instructor didn`t have any of the urgency that the fellow on CBC did, never raised his voice nor got mad at anyone. Feel free to have a look at their website: http://www.tigrentlearning.ca/

Please note that it doesn`t say Rich Dad anywhere on there. Strange? Not really, because Tigrent just uses the Rich Dad brand to sell the seminars. Maybe now you`re getting a clearer picture of what`s going on, and that Robert Kiyosaki is not a scammer. I wouldn`t even find a website representing Russ Whitney, so maybe he`s the problem in all this.

Mecheng, would you like to quiz me to see how much I know about real estate investing after a 3 day, $500 seminar?
 

Mecheng

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In the video the instructor is asked why they are raising their credit card limits and he says if for future investments.
Double check the video in case you miss that part.
Why raise your card limit if you don`t but the courses? Raise your LOC limit at 1/5 the rate.

The point people are making is the Rich Dad brand was used to sell the course in the video.
Therefore RK is responsible for the actions of that instructor selling his brand.

Perhaps you’re the one not reading other peoples posts.
My post specifically asks, is there some value in the course that this report doesn`t reveal
and is it only this instructor and his tactics or the course in general that is a high pressured sales pitch.

I wouldn`t dare quiz you after a 3 day seminar, I`m sure your expertise can`t be matched.
 

JimWhitelaw

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Hi Gen1GT, people are reading, don`t worry. I think that most people do get that the education company is just a licensee of the Rich Dad brand, but RK still has to bear some responsibility for their events.

Also, Tigrent IS Whitney - they are the same company with a new name. They have a long history of changing their name once they start getting a lot of heat and bad press. They`ve also used "Whitney Intelligence Network", "Wealth Intelligence Academy", "Russ Whitney Education Group" and more. I`m not saying that nobody has ever received something of value from them, because obviously there are some satisfied customers like yourself.

Here is Tigrent`s EDGAR page. As a publicly traded company you can find all their quarterly reports online. If you look at the most recent quarterly filing, you can see that they previously reported as "WHITNEY INFORMATION NETWORK, INC. ".

http://google.brand.edgar-online.com/defau...companyid=11271

Have a look at the many pages of complaints about Whitney, et al on RipOffReport.com:

http://www.ripoffreport.com/Search/Whitney.aspx

Odd that Marketplace never uncovered any of this. Perhaps nobody at CBC knows how to use Google.
 

gwasser

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QUOTE (Gen1GT @ Feb 1 2010, 07:04 PM) I don`t know where using credit cards to pay for real estate down payments came from, because that wasn`t the point of raising the credit card limits. There were no suprises. They want you to pay for your seminars with your credit card, and they tell you that on day one.

Once again, it appears that nobody is even reading my posts, because nobody is making the distinction that these courses are not held by Rich Dad, but are licensed to private educators. The one I went to, was held by Tigrent Learning, not Whitney. Can we all imagine for a second that these $500 seminars may be different because of this? Our instructor didn`t have any of the urgency that the fellow on CBC did, never raised his voice nor got mad at anyone. Feel free to have a look at their website: http://www.tigrentlearning.ca/

Please note that it doesn`t say Rich Dad anywhere on there. Strange? Not really, because Tigrent just uses the Rich Dad brand to sell the seminars. Maybe now you`re getting a clearer picture of what`s going on, and that Robert Kiyosaki is not a scammer. I wouldn`t even find a website representing Russ Whitney, so maybe he`s the problem in all this.

Mecheng, would you like to quiz me to see how much I know about real estate investing after a 3 day, $500 seminar?

Gen1GT, I appreciate you standing up for a cause you believe in. But sometimes, those causes cannot be defended, even though some of the `good` gets thrown away with the bathwater. I am glad, that you had better presenters than the one shown on CBC and that many others had.
 

fhabib

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Hi guys

I am not sure the issue is with Robert K., the issue most probably is with Whitney.

I have used Whitney courses in the past, probably 8 years ago and my experience was quite dissatisfying. The stuff we saw on the video was a normal practice.

It is true that we are blessed with REIN ... Having REIN makes it easy to see what other companies are offering and whether it is a scam or real eduction.

I have seen quite a few and it always comes to this ... "Always be weiry from anyone who pushes you to run to the back and write your name or buy stuff".. I am not saying they always have to be a scam, i am just saying in this situation some bells should be ringing in your head inviting you back to rational thinking..

Thank you Don, Russel, Tony Peters and others for providing Real Education, Canadian Education, with Integrity .... GREAT :)
 
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