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Rental properties VS franchise business

alexh

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I am currently analyzing both purchasing rental properties vs buying a business.

I am told that they are both similar commodities, as they both can build equity, generate cash flow, and appreciate,

And possibly a business can build as much appreciation, and generate alot more cash flow.

How do they both really differenciate, when the bottom line is, to make money, and both to manage from afar.
 

EdRenkema

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QUOTE (alexh @ Feb 14 2009, 03:53 PM) I am currently analyzing both purchasing rental properties vs buying a business.
I am told that they are both similar commodities, as they both can build equity, generate cash flow, and appreciate,

And possibly a business can build as much appreciation, and generate alot more cash flow.

How do they both really differenciate, when the bottom line is, to make money, and both to manage from afar.

I was considering the same options prior to joining REIN and decided to join REIN and begin investing in RE. What I have learned is when you buy a franchise you are not so much buying a product you are buying a system. For example: most of us can make a better hamburger that McDonald`s but most (all) of us cannot
build a better business system than McDonald`s.
Real Estate is a hard asset that can appreciate over time particularly in inflationary times. RE should be a long term -5yrs or longer investment that should be positive cashflow to survive through downturns.
A franchise is a business system that can provide positive cashflow, my thoughts are to buy a peice of RE with the franchise paying the cashflow or being the anchor tenant on a commercial property.
RE should be bought and managed with a system as well, another reason I chose to join REIN - there is a system.
 

Nir

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QUOTE (alexh @ Feb 14 2009, 02:53 PM) I am currently analyzing both purchasing rental properties vs buying a business.

I am told that they are both similar commodities, as they both can build equity, generate cash flow, and appreciate,

And possibly a business can build as much appreciation, and generate alot more cash flow.

How do they both really differenciate, when the bottom line is, to make money, and both to manage from afar.


It`s also a matter of personal preference. in a way it`s like asking why did Joe study philosophy and Albert Psychiatry.
However, there is a reason more people invest in real estate than buy a specific business. The first is easier - I think financing wise and also for the average investor easier access to tons of relevant information on investing in RE.
 

Thomas Beyer

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QUOTE (alexh @ Feb 14 2009, 02:53 PM) I am currently analyzing both purchasing rental properties vs buying a business.

I am told that they are both similar commodities, as they both can build equity, generate cash flow, and appreciate,

And possibly a business can build as much appreciation, and generate alot more cash flow.

How do they both really differenciate, when the bottom line is, to make money, and both to manage from afar.
what is the nature of the franchise ?

Some franchises work well only with very hands on managers/owners .. whereas a piece of real estate can be managed with a few hours/year if set up right ..
 

alexh

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I am not speaking of any franchise in particular.

Some franchises rely on the owner to operate hands on, some others allow you to pull out and manage, depending on what your time is worth, you may consider any of the following.

At the end of it all, is it fair to say that building a franchise (or business) VS rental propertie is very similar by comparison?

Is there any of the two that has a winning advantage in regards to profitability, given the same investment and time (effort)?

ex:
1 - purchase a propertie, rent it out, get posiive cash flow. / Home value appreciates in time. (tangible value)
2 - buy equipment, or stock, sell it, get positive cash flow. / Business value appreciates in time. (intangible value)

similar?
 

Thomas Beyer

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QUOTE (alexh @ Feb 15 2009, 02:33 AM) At the end of it all, is it fair to say that building a franchise (or business) VS rental propertie is very similar by comparison?
the MAIN difference is a piece of real estate
a) can be FINANCED easier and cheaper, especially an apartment building as it can be CMHC insured, ie. the cost of money is lower or MUCH lower (i.e. most franchise owners pay cash or get a loan secured against other assets, as a loan-to-value for a new franchise is tough to establish, maybe you get 30% on physical assets such as restaurant equipment at prime + 6%, i.e. a 9% interest rate, vs. a CMHC loan is around 3.5% to 4% today .. 50% cheaper !!)
b) can be SOLD easier / cheaper, i.e. is more liquid
c) has more "freedom", i.e. there is no dependency on a franchisor which may require you to invest, may change its % of fee or may not live up to its promises re national advertising, branding etc. ..
d) is more expensive to build, i.e. replacement costs re higher than purchased price,
e) is a lot less depending on the owner, location, "luck", the economy, the competition etc. ..
f) is a physical asset that is harder to clone, so the 1st "Starbucks or McDonald`s or Shell gas station or .." might do OK in a city, and the 2nd too .. but perhaps the 35th (yours) might not do so well due to saturation .. i.e. related to point d) "cloning" is harder to do in a physical piece of real estate
g) is less designed to buy a job, whereas many franchises are just that: you buy yourself a job, i.e. income is the focus not equity

Given these advantages of real estate, often the yield is much higher on a franchise to compensate for these 7 main dis-advantages !

I would say that a franchise yield, net after counting a wage for yourself or the general manager, needs to be about 15-25% (i.e. a P/E of 4 to 7), whereas real estate usually is 5-10% yield (or CAP rate) only. In many instances those high yields are not achievable in a franchise .. but if they are then they are certainly worth a consideration !

Consider giving FranNet a call to discuss your specific needs to match you up with a potential fit.
 

alexh

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QUOTE (thomasbeyer2000 @ Feb 15 2009, 08:26 AM) the MAIN difference is a piece of real estate
a) can be FINANCED easier and cheaper, especially an apartment building as it can be CMHC insured, ie. the cost of money is lower or MUCH lower (i.e. most franchise owners pay cash or get a loan secured against other assets, as a loan-to-value for a new franchise is tough to establish, maybe you get 30% on physical assets such as restaurant equipment at prime + 6%, i.e. a 9% interest rate, vs. a CMHC loan is around 3.5% to 4% today .. 50% cheaper !!)
b) can be SOLD easier / cheaper, i.e. is more liquid
c) has more "freedom", i.e. there is no dependency on a franchisor which may require you to invest, may change its % of fee or may not live up to its promises re national advertising, branding etc. ..
d) is more expensive to build, i.e. replacement costs re higher than purchased price,
e) is a lot less depending on the owner, location, "luck", the economy, the competition etc. ..
f) is a physical asset that is harder to clone, so the 1st "Starbucks or McDonald`s or Shell gas station or .." might do OK in a city, and the 2nd too .. but perhaps the 35th (yours) might not do so well due to saturation .. i.e. related to point d) "cloning" is harder to do in a physical piece of real estate
g) is less designed to buy a job, whereas many franchises are just that: you buy yourself a job, i.e. income is the focus not equity

Given these advantages of real estate, often the yield is much higher on a franchise to compensate for these 7 main dis-advantages !

I would say that a franchise yield, net after counting a wage for yourself or the general manager, needs to be about 15-25% (i.e. a P/E of 4 to 7), whereas real estate usually is 5-10% yield (or CAP rate) only. In many instances those high yields are not achievable in a franchise .. but if they are then they are certainly worth a consideration !

Consider giving FranNet a call to discuss your specific needs to match you up with a potential fit.



It seems like its a question of personal choice, where you feel more comfortable and your immediate needs.
Buying a business might suit the needs of someone who needs to create a job, because it will focus on generating income.
If you rely on income from cash flow properties to feed yourself, an unexpected expense could take your weekly salary, in that case diversification is key. (like you said, focused on equity building)
I would suggest that rental properties, unless you can work out a decent cash fow through a volume of purchases, isnt the most reliable source of steady income. Not to say it cant be done, just not in as short of a period compared to a business.

I was asking because one of my investing partners is debating investing full time in real estate, but is worried because he doesnt have another job.
We are trying to create a job investing full time in real estate.
 

Thomas Beyer

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QUOTE (alexh @ Feb 16 2009, 02:42 AM) I would suggest that rental properties, unless you can work out a decent cash fow through a volume of purchases, isnt the most reliable source of steady income. ...
We are trying to create a job investing full time in real estate.
yes .. it takes time .. and a large asset base .. or low low leverage .. i.e. huge cash in .. but the main benefit of real estate is best achieved with low interest rate mortgages with appropriate leverage ..

so yes, a franchise CAN BE a better income provider .. depending on desire to work the counter or GM position @ M&Ms, or Starbucks or UPS Store or McDonald`s or East Side Mario`s ..
 

21krunner

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Alexh,

Many years ago I found myself thinking along the same lines as per your questions. As I was not intending to give up my day job I was looking for an investment that required only mimimal day to day that between my spouse and I could run on a part time basis. We looked into franchising somewhat extensively and had several meeting with various groups. I didn`t pull the trigger though. I recall my thinking was that the franchines were overpriced in my estimation by a factor of 100% or more. Also I was mostly looking at those franchises with a relatively low entry level cash requirement (ie <100K). At that price point the businesses involved are generally low tech or even no tech. As you know once you sign up for a franchise you are agreeing to send 5-7% of your revenue to the mothership. Forever. I concluded that after a couple of years in a relatively low complexity business I would probably begin to begrudge sending those funds off each month. That is also what a few business owners advised as well.

In any case I would also tend to agree that if you are planning on keeping your day job.. Real estate is IMHO better.
a) You won`t need the money
b) The RE involvement can be structure to be fairly passive

I think a little harder to do that with a business since most owners would want to handle the cash everyday.

Cheers
 

alexh

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Thanks for the reply.
Here is the current situation. My partner/investor was laid off his career job. And received a compensation for an early termination, about 135K.
Now the compensation involves a large capital to work with at the expenses of his day job. Now we are in a dilemma if that money would be better put to use invested in a business franchise, or a rental propertie. (commercial, residential, multi-plex)

Considering his immediate needs the person is out of a job.

WE cant do both, since the 135K wont stretch far enough to buy both a franchise and a propertie.
The franchise model allows you to manage without beeing in the store (general manager), so you still have your freedom to work other jobs, but so does the rental propertie.
 

EdRenkema

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Just for interest sake check out this site www.coffeeculture.ca this is the one I was looking and they set you up with a gov`t backed loan (you pay a hefty premium) and do not have to pledge any collateral
 

AndyLuchies

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my 2 cents.

my wife is getting a B.A. in business and they discussed franchises in one of her classes. In her business class they were not liked too much (you`re paying others to take most of the risk yourself). Be careful what you choose, many small franchises make more money off of owner turn-over through start-up fees than through business (a well-known Pizza chain does this very thing). I`ve been suspicious of franchises for the simple idea that they use their system to make money off you...you`re the middleman when in reality you want to be the guy at the top... at REIN you use REIN`s system to make money for yourself.

in RE, you are getting paid to do the research (that`s where the money is), in a franchise you are paying the franchise to do the money-making stuff.

you either pay big money for an established niche (Tim Horton`s), or pay little for a small start up company that`s trying to compete with a niche that`s already filled (e.g. coffee culture).

Relatives of mine just started a franchise and i`m concerned for them simply because it seems to me that the franchise doesn`t really care for them....never a good sign.

My advice would be, unless you can find an untapped niche, let the franchise go.
but then again, i`ve done little research, sometimes the numbers are good in a booming area...
 

manojsingh

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Hi There,
Franchise is also binding where you are at the mercy of others. If you are an independent thinker then this is not for you.All terms are in the favour of franchisor.
 
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