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Interest Deductibility

shangb

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A while back I bought an investment property entirely financed with my Line of Credit. I deducted the interest expense against the revenues of the property. I then paid off entirely the LoC when rates were a lot higher.

Now rates are lower and I would like to re-finance. If I collect for example $200K on the refinancing, can I now re-start deducting the interest expense? Or do I have to take the $200K and show a direct link to purchasing another investment property (or other eligible investment such as a dividend paying stock).

I have looked through this interpretation bulletin but I am not sure.

http://www.cra-arc.gc.ca/E/pub/tp/it533/it533-e.pdf
 

seanverret

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It depends what you invest the money in. If you buy boats for your cottage, then no. If you buy stocks, real estate, or gold as an investment then yes.
 

navaz

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The rule is "direct use" That means interest is deductible if the borrowed funds were directly used for investment purposes. Once you sell the investment you cannot deduct the interest any more.
 

shangb

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QUOTE (navaz @ Mar 13 2009, 10:56 AM) The rule is "direct use" That means interest is deductible if the borrowed funds were directly used for investment purposes. Once you sell the investment you cannot deduct the interest any more.


Just to be clear, I have not SOLD the property. I simply want to re-finance it to take advantage of lower rates.
 

seanverret

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QUOTE (shangb @ Mar 13 2009, 09:26 AM) Just to be clear, I have not SOLD the property. I simply want to re-finance it to take advantage of lower rates.

Considering you paid of the LOC originally, if you got another LOC - you`d have to show what you did with the funds from that LOC to see whether or not you could claim that interest. However, if you`re getting a mortgage on the property (e.g. refinancing) then the interest of that mortgage would be deductible w.r.t. that property. I`m not a tax advisor, but that`s the way I interpret the rules...

It all comes down to intent, and can you prove your intentions to CRA.
 

Tammy

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Interest deductibility is one of the more complicated areas of tax a real estate investor will encounter. I`ll try to illustrate by way of some examples.

Lets say you have a $100,000 line of credit (LOC) that currently has a zero balance. You use $100,000 of the LOC to purchase a rental property (Property A). The interest you pay on the LOC would be deductible from the rental income you earn on Property A. At a later date you are able to pay off the entire LOC so the balance on your LOC is zero again. Now let`s look at a bunch of possible scenarios. These scenarios are independent of each other.

1) You borrow $100,000 from your LOC to purchase another rental property (Property B). The interest on your LOC could now be deducted from rental income earned on Property B.

2) You borrow $100,000 from your LOC to take an around-the-world vacation. The interest on the LOC would not be deductible.

3) You borrow $100,000 from your LOC to buy a cottage on the lake that you are not going to be renting out. The interest on the LOC would not be deductible.

4) You borrow $100,000 from your LOC to take a $50,000 around-the-world vacation and put a $50,000 down payment on a rental property (Property C). You would think that you could deduct half the interest on the LOC from the rental income earned on Property C but CRA could deny the deduction because the deductibility of the interest on the LOC has been "tainted" by the purchase of the vacation that you cannot deduct interest for.

5) Property A currently has no mortgage so you decide to get an $80,000 mortgage on Property A to purchase another rental property (Property D). The interest on Property A`s mortgage could be deducted from rental income earned on Property D.

6) Property A currently has no mortgage so you decide to get an $80,000 mortgage on Property A to take an around-the-world vacation. The interest on Property A`s mortgage would not be deductible.

And one more scenario... you have a rental property (Property E) that you purchased for $100,000 with an $80,000 mortgage, the interest on the $80,000 mortgage would be deductible from rental income earned from Property E. Time has passed and Property E is now worth $200,000 and has a mortgage of $60,000. You decide you want to take some of your profit off the table to enjoy life a bit so you refinance the property back to 80% and get a new $160,000 mortgage. You use the extra money to take a well earned vacation, buy a new car and to pay for your child`s University tuition. Is the interest on the $160,000 mortgage deductible? You have to look at what the funds from the $160,000 mortgage were used for, the funds were used for a vacation, a car, University tuition, and to purchase Property E. You are now in a situation similar to scenario 4) above. You can definitely not deduct the interest on the entire refinanced mortgage and CRA could possibly deny you the interest deduction on the entire mortgage because the mortgage has now been tainted due to part of the mortgage being used to purchase things that you cannot deduct the interest on.

These are just some possible scenarios, there are many, many more possible situations. The key is that you must be able to directly trace the borrowed funds to what the borrowed funds are being used for to be able to determine if the interest will be deductible. Don`t co-mingle your borrowed money and keep really, really, really good records of what the borrowed money was used for, do that and you have a much better chance of your interest deduction being allowed by CRA. No deduction is ever 100% guaranteed to make it through an audit by CRA but following the rules and keeping good records definitely increases the odds.
 

realfortin

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QUOTE (Tammy @ Mar 14 2009, 02:36 PM) Interest deductibility is one of the more complicated areas of tax a real estate investor will encounter. I`ll try to illustrate by way of some examples.

Tammy, great post! Keep it handy as yu will get the exact same questions this time next year. You have provided a few really good accounting posts in the last while, well done and keep it up.

Real
 

billf

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Great Post,

I have one more scenerio to add to the pile if you could answer.

Say you had a property with a 100,000 mortgage and after 5 years you paid down to 60,000. Could you not reborrow to the original 100,000 and use the money for whatever, and still have deductibility. You have paid taxes on your income to generate the money for the down payment and paid taxes on the rental income that paid down the mortgage.

If not, this is a great argument for the largest possible mortgage with the longest amortization possible. It actually discourages savings.

BillF
 

Torontoskov

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QUOTE (billf @ Mar 15 2009, 09:11 AM) Great Post,

I have one more scenerio to add to the pile if you could answer.

Say you had a property with a 100,000 mortgage and after 5 years you paid down to 60,000. Could you not reborrow to the original 100,000 and use the money for whatever, and still have deductibility. You have paid taxes on your income to generate the money for the down payment and paid taxes on the rental income that paid down the mortgage.

If not, this is a great argument for the largest possible mortgage with the longest amortization possible. It actually discourages savings.

BillF

Great post Tammy!

BillF I think it`s quite clear you need to link what you borrowed to how you spent it. It doesn`t matter if the funds you receive are from the equity in a business/rental etc. If the money is used for recreational purposes IT IS NOT deductible, if it`s used to purchase an income producing instrument (property, stocks) IT IS generally deductible - check w/ your accountant.

Also, if you decide to re finance and take some equity out and use some for fun and some for business make sure you open seperate accounts. I`m going through this presently and I`m adament w/ the bank that they cannot mingle the two LOC I have.
 

Torontoskov

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QUOTE (billf @ Mar 15 2009, 09:11 AM) If not, this is a great argument for the largest possible mortgage with the longest amortization possible. It actually discourages savings.

BillF

Well I guess if you take the longest mortgage and longest amort and use the extra cash flow to buy non deductible frivolous items than you`ll get what you deserve....but that`s a question of utility! If you take the extra cash flow and divert it to non deductible debt reduction or income producing ventures that you`ll hopefully be wealthier and better off for it. Besides who really saves anyway when you`re buying properties all the time!!!
 

Tammy

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Hi BillF,

It is a good question to ask but unfortunately mortgaging back up to your original mortgage amount doesn`t get a person out of having to look at what the funds are being used for. If you had an original mortgage for $100,000 that is now at $60,000 and you refinance back up to $100,000 you have a situation similar to Scenario 4) and you have to look at what the funds from the new $100,000 mortgage are being used for. Part of the new $100,000 mortgage was used to purchase rental property but the mortgage could end up being tainted depending on what the rest of the funds are used for.




*****

And just one further note to add... the examples I provided above only apply if you own your property personally, if you own them in a corporation and refinance you are now dealing with a different set of variables.
 

billf

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Tammy and Torontoskov,

Thanks for the clarification, this deductibility issue is something that I have always wondered about.

As for the longest amortization possible comment, I feel that unless you are actively reborrowing to purchase properties, stocks etc... paying down your business mortgage is to be discouraged from a tax point of view. I will go as long as possible, especially with these rates.

Bill F
 

Tina

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In "shangb"`s original post he stated that he purchased a property with a LOC and paid off the LOC when rates were high. Wouldn`t the deductiblity of a new LOC`s interest depend on where the money came from to pay off the original LOC. If "shangb" dug into his personal "after tax dollars" to pay off the original LOC then the "rental property" would owe him that money and the new LOC could be the rental property paying back the debt to him personally and therefore be deductible no matter what he spent the money on...
 

Tammy

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Hi Tina,

CRA`s interest deductibility rules only look at the money you borrowed and what the borrowed money is being used for. How you were able to pay off the original LOC to be able to use the LOC again is not part of the equation. In CRA`s eyes if you own your rental property personally it is not separate from you and cannot owe you money.

What you actually spend the borrowed money on always matters.
 
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