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Potential Tenants

invst4profit

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Something else to keep in mind when screening tenants in Ontario when considering a group like "3 young boys".
This situation often leads to one or more of the individuals moving out to be replaced by other "friends". You do not have the right to screen or approve these new tenants. In Ontario you can not prevent those new individuals from moving in and can not force them to sign a lease. It is not uncommon, over time, to have a complete set of tenants that have never been screened or signed a lease. Many times it is possible to not have any information on them what so ever.
This is another reason to not rent to young single applicants as they may also bring in a roommate that is not an acceptable tenant.

Imagine going to the LTB with an eviction request without even knowing your tenants names let alone having a signed lease agreement for them.
 

EdRenkema

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QUOTE (NeilUttamsingh @ Jun 7 2009, 09:39 PM) Joe,

Excellent post!

The real lesson that I took away here was, to COMPLETELY remove all emotion from the decision making process.

To your point, when people lack experience as landlords, generally, they feel `bad` for the hard luck professional tenant actors. Agreed.

To those new landlords reading this post, my advice to you would be to remove all your emotions for the process of selecting tenants. Treat your real estate investing like a business. You are not running a charity. Don`t be fooled. Do your due diligence and always trust your gut feeling.


Neil,
Manoj just PM`d me, this is the same lady contacting him about his vacancy, it will be interesting to see the current version of her story.
 

koop

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Great thread guys, I can see how looking at each potential tenant without the emotion is key. My wife`s grandparents had a "professional tenant" a couple years ago, so many stories, parents and other family moving in and BIG trouble. Grandpa almost got arrested because of a story they made up about him. And even my wife and I had to come and help clean up the mess.

(the reason that was given for eviction was that they had a potbelly pig in the house)
 

manojsingh

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Hi Ed
I also got confirmation from Neil that she is the same lady. I will keep you posted with the latest version. Thanks
 

blueruby

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QUOTE (manojsingh @ Jun 8 2009, 12:03 PM) Hi Ed
I also got confirmation from Neil that she is the same lady. I will keep you posted with the latest version. Thanks


Hello All,
Although I am not a REIN member, I follow their philosophies and guidance religiously. I am greatful that I do, as the same person trying to con you guys has contacted me about my property.
Thankfully, I read the board everyday and have just averted a potential tenant disaster. If it were not for this board and REIN, I would have made a new landlord mistake by forgetting this is a business and should be run as such.
Thank you all for your infinite knowledge base and willingness to share.
GREATLY APPRECIATED!
 

vandriani

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Although this person has not comitted any crimes yet, she is of the intension to do so. Is there not any authority that could be contacted and made aware for this person?
 

EdRenkema

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I got another phone call today from a forum member in Hamilton indicating the same person applying for rent, don`t know the whole story.
 

invst4profit

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QUOTE (andriani @ Jun 8 2009, 01:30 PM) Although this person has not committed any crimes yet, she is of the intention to do so. Is there not any authority that could be contacted and made aware for this person?

What crime do you see being committed. In Ontario the police do not get involved in LL tenant disputes.
Bad checks, property damage, you name it the police do not want any part of it.
 

vandriani

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QUOTE (invst4profit @ Jun 8 2009, 12:20 PM) What crime do you see being committed. In Ontario the police do not get involved in LL tenant disputes.
Bad checks, property damage, you name it the police do not want any part of it.


Okay, let me re-phrase, maybe someone should contact the local media. They might be able to shed light on these types of tenants and therefore get the word out to other LL. 99% of the time the news stories portray LL as the bad guys, this is an opertunity to show the public that there are bad tenants as well as LL.
 

mflynn

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Hi Ed, can you post the person`s name here??? or do you think she`s not using her real name. I`ve currently got 3 places available and can`t believe that I haven`t heard from her???

thanks

Mary
 

jwilbrin

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QUOTE (mflynn @ Jun 8 2009, 04:05 PM) Hi Ed, can you post the person`s name here??? or do you think she`s not using her real name. I`ve currently got 3 places available and can`t believe that I haven`t heard from her???

thanks

Mary

I would caution anyone on posting names in a public forum. Send the info via PM. You could be violating Canadian privacy laws by divulging information supplied to you via a tenant application.
 

JulieHoffman

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OMG! This is hysterical! Was there really another REIN member who declined these people?

Oh I am so glad you didn`t rent to them. Good work.

There is nothing wrong with having a big heart. It`s not personal, it`s just business.

That is toooo funny!

I really hope you attract some AMAZING tenants soon. Really, good job going on myreinspace first.

I have rented to that lady. I think she used to live in Edmonton. LOL.

Best of Luck.
 

manojsingh

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Hi Here is the latest email. Please comment on this. Please enlighten me also that why we are saying that she is doing something wrong. She is looking for rent without last month rent (many do this and negotiate for this).
"Hi I apologize for tonight I did not have your phone number with me Had a flat tire just now got it fixed its almost 10.
Your application is a little intimidating you seem to need a full background check, not that it concerns me you won`t find much except for less than perfect credit due to the death of my husband and me encurring the debt.
Anyways, I will fax this off tomorrow and we can meet wednesday evening if you accept the application.
Thank You"
 

invst4profit

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She is a con artist.
Every statement she makes is followed by some elaborate excuse. I would guess she is a compulsive liar based on the pattern of her communications.
As an example by implying that the LL wants too much information and then giving another excuse for why he will find less than stellar results she is attempting to dismiss her TERRABLE credit report.

This applicant will never likely pay rent on time, will only make partial payments, at some point will stop paying entirely and will have some elaborate emotional excuse every single time for why her personal life is so difficult.
In the end she will be evicted after probably living free for about six months.
There is nothing illegal about any of her actions she is simply a leach on society
 

RandyDalton

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QUOTE (EdRenkema @ Jun 6 2009, 03:41 PM) I have 3 applicaitions for a townhouse in Hamilton, 2 of them are not keepers, first a couple with 3 kids and a big dog and shaky references, poor credit, every time I called them there is pandemonium in the background, second 3 young guys who`ve never lived together, one still lives at home, one full time smoker, good jobs, good references.
My best candidates are a family of 3 adults, currently paying just above my asking rent, credit not so good but stellar references from 2 previous landlords - moving from current rental due to landlord selling house. They declined to rent earlier in the week but she called back today asking for a break on last month`s rent deposit, here is her message to me:

Hi Ed: Well we would love to rent your unit. However some terrible chain of events have occured recently, first the death in the family and then I had purchased a money order for $1500 so I had it available to a new landlord for last months rent and a little reserve towards first. I had left my purse on a bench at a park went to go and get it about 15 minutes later to find my ID money and money order gone. So now I no longer have any way to obtain last month again by Saturday when we have to move out of our current residence and due to the fact we would be moving mid month would be looking to pay for half a month as we did not reside somewhere a whole month. So basically, I would need to negotiate last month rent with someone and I will be getting back last month from my current landlady and that won`t be until 30 days after the move out...not sure why she is doing it that way but really cause we lived there half a month for her to offer the full month back is generous so whatever it takes I guess. I am not sure if you would negotiate last month with us (extra payments) or be able to wait till we get the refund back and accept the 662.50 for half of June on friday June 12 and allow us to move on the 13th. I realize it is a lot to ask of anyone but we are potentially homeless as of Sunday June 14th.You seemed to be such a kind man and I hope we can work something out to be able to rent from you. Let me know your thoughts on it I can meet you anytime after 3 on Friday with the 662 cash payment. We can then sign a lease and move on saturday if you would give us the keys on friday.Again, I know it is a lot to ask let me know either way.

Now I can see some of you rolling your eyes but I need tenants, they seem sincere and I would like to help these people out. They have first month rent, how can I set up my lease to require them to pay the last month rent deposit once they receive the other back?
I have put out a call to the current landlord and am waiting for a call back.
Bear in mind if I can pull this off I will instill incredible loyalty in my tenants.


Wow! This was a great post and learning lesson for me. As I read the first few posts my thoughts were to consider what she was saying and talk with the existing landlord to find out their experiences with this tenant. I know from experience that my wife constantly left everything behind during her pregnancy and shortly after my daughter was born. Hormones do crazy things to your mind. And my near photographic memory when I was younger has been diminished to trying to remember what I had for breakfast. Seriously. It is a big joke with my now teenage daughter.

But then I read Neil`s post. Wow was I wrong!

However if this ever happened to me then my curiosity would get the better of me. I would want to talk with the evicting landlord to get the whole story.

Regards...Randy D.
 

housingrental

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Your post brought a big smile to my face
Thank you

QUOTE (invst4profit @ Jun 9 2009, 08:24 AM) She is a con artist.
Every statement she makes is followed by some elaborate excuse. I would guess she is a compulsive liar based on the pattern of her communications.
As an example by implying that the LL wants too much information and then giving another excuse for why he will find less than stellar results she is attempting to dismiss her TERRABLE credit report.

This applicant will never likely pay rent on time, will only make partial payments, at some point will stop paying entirely and will have some elaborate emotional excuse every single time for why her personal life is so difficult.
In the end she will be evicted after probably living free for about six months.
There is nothing illegal about any of her actions she is simply a leach on society
 

koop

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WOW, REIN is like a mob, that poor, poor lady will be living under a bridge in a couple days and we just all laugh.
Did she live in Alberta in the past? This sounds like one of my buddies past tenants.
 

invst4profit

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There is no reason to feel sorry for her she will eventually find a nice place to live with some unsuspecting soft hearted LL. They always do.
 

Savard

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QUOTE (koop @ Jun 9 2009, 08:52 AM) WOW, REIN is like a mob, that poor, poor lady will be living under a bridge in a couple days and we just all laugh.
Did she live in Alberta in the past? This sounds like one of my buddies past tenants.


I think the idea that this lady may live under a bridge or come into serious problems is a new and completely separate issue from her being a prospective tenant.

If she were to fall on hard times, I may choose to help her in some way that does not involve her being my client.

This would be having a good heart or Charity. Def: giving without expecting any thing (read: money) in return.



Allowing a bad tenant to rent your unit at a discounted rate is bad business.



I can’t see any connection between the two decisions.





In the past, I defended the above thoughts with an acquaintance who took offence to me evicting a non-paying tenant.

He thought I should subsidize a tenant instead of eviction. The conversation did not reach any middle ground. The conversation deteriorated and I felt I had to justify my separation of business and charity. Me telling him that I give to an over seas orphanage where I cannot get a tax return did not help this conversation. Sadly, my contributions to charity are greater than this man and he confronts me on being a “slumlord” without a heart.
 

JoefromTO

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QUOTE (Savard @ Jun 9 2009, 12:27 PM) I think the idea that this lady may live under a bridge or come into serious problems is a new and completely separate issue from her being a prospective tenant.

If she were to fall on hard times, I may choose to help her in some way that does not involve her being my client.

This would be having a good heart or Charity. Def: giving without expecting any thing (read: money) in return.



Allowing a bad tenant to rent your unit at a discounted rate is bad business.



I can`t see any connection between the two decisions.





In the past, I defended the above thoughts with an acquaintance who took offence to me evicting a non-paying tenant.

He thought I should subsidize a tenant instead of eviction. The conversation did not reach any middle ground. The conversation deteriorated and I felt I had to justify my separation of business and charity. Me telling him that I give to an over seas orphanage where I cannot get a tax return did not help this conversation. Sadly, my contributions to charity are greater than this man and he confronts me on being a "slumlord" without a heart.

Different strokes for different folks. Maybe the acquaitance should get his/her own rental property and such a tenant...see if he/she still feels the same way.

I don`t bother with people like that any more. I have found that friends/acquaintances come and go. There is nothing you could do to try and convince that what you tried to do was protect your own interests. You will always look like the evil person... so here is my advice to anyone who has ever or will ever get into this type of scenario...

...If you are conducting business and something you do which is consistent with your normal business practice, upsets someone or potentially offends someone and you are now viewed as the "bad guy", then allow yourself to be titled as the bad guy, because from that moment on, there is NOTHING you can do to change that persons opinion of you, even if you give in to their request. If you gave into their request you are now not only a bad guy that they have temporarily allowed back into their friends list, but they think your a soft sucker. So accept it, control your emotions and become the bad guy (so to speak) and conduct business in accordance to what you would normally do and produce the results you require.

I should also point out that the request should be something that you cannot tolerate.


I find that many people cannot appreciate what others go through in life. They just pass judgement because its easy to do.
 
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