What is the main reason Sudbury is NOT ranked among the top 10 cities to invest in Ontario in the most recent report/research conducted by Don and his team?
From some aspects, like price per unit, it`s perhaps #1. vacancy rate too.. I think. Obviously, there are other considerations. I just wonder what is the main reason/"issue" with Sudbury that does not rank it among the top cities(?)
I think that maybe it is for a few reasons. Single family homes and duplexes in Sudbury are now fairly expensive against the rent you may get. Where you do seem to get ahead is with the multi family units. They are very cheap considering the rent you can get with them. The Vacancy rate is very much in our favor there and the employment statistics have change drastically over the last few years. Now the mines are not the major source of employment and they have balanced it all out with other employers, as well as universities etc.
Another great indicator is the income vs housing cost. People in that area are seeing more and more disposable income. That is great in that it allows people to afford higher rents, but it also reduces the amount of renters because they buy their own houses. That has also caused the single family home market in Sudbury to go nuts, hence why the house prices are higher than what would be profitable from renting out. It is a very funny economy in Sudbury in that many triplexes with 2 or 3 bedrooms in them are cheaper than most single family bungalows. That`s a good example of supply and demand.
Sudbury is definitely worth looking into. In fact I am going exploring there in 2 weeks with the hope of purchasing my 1st rental property.
QUOTE (realfortin @ Jul 31 2008, 03:01 PM) I think that maybe it is for a few reasons. Single family homes and duplexes in Sudbury are now fairly expensive against the rent you may get. Where you do seem to get ahead is with the multi family units. They are very cheap considering the rent you can get with them. The Vacancy rate is very much in our favor there and the employment statistics have change drastically over the last few years. Now the mines are not the major source of employment and they have balanced it all out with other employers, as well as universities etc.
Another great indicator is the income vs housing cost. People in that area are seeing more and more disposable income. That is great in that it allows people to afford higher rents, but it also reduces the amount of renters because they buy their own houses. That has also caused the single family home market in Sudbury to go nuts, hence why the house prices are higher than what would be profitable from renting out. It is a very funny economy in Sudbury in that many triplexes with 2 or 3 bedrooms in them are cheaper than most single family bungalows. That`s a good example of supply and demand.
Sudbury is definitely worth looking into. In fact I am going exploring there in 2 weeks with the hope of purchasing my 1st rental property.
Keep in mind that "other employers" in Sudbury are primarily the suppliers and service providers to the mining companies. On the surface it does look that not everyone is in mining there, in reality - the majority of the jobs are directly or indirectly dependent on the mines and the metal prices.
QUOTE (Dejavu @ Jul 31 2008, 02:12 PM) Keep in mind that "other employers" in Sudbury are primarily the suppliers and service providers to the mining companies. On the surface it does look that not everyone is in mining there, in reality - the majority of the jobs are directly or indirectly dependent on the mines and the metal prices.
Well, yes and no. It has become the economic hub for Northern Ontario. Businesses and offices cater to the area. Additionally, LAurentien University and the colleges are expanding quite a bit. The mines have been downsizing and yet the inmigration continues. There as less miners now than there ever were.
Even if it was the case that it relied only on the mines, the need for nickel and copper(the major minerals mined there) continue to increase as well as the price (overal, not in the last weeks). The two major mines are rumoured to consider a merger that will allow them to pool resources and expand.
I find this to be a very interesting discussion. It would be great if someone from Don`s research team can explain why Sudbury is not among the top 10 or if it would be had they conducted the research today(?)
Real, good luck in Sudbury! I plan to be there myself within 2-4 weeks.. (I live in Toronto)
QUOTE (investmart @ Jul 31 2008, 10:35 PM) Thank you Real and Dejavu,
I find this to be a very interesting discussion. It would be great if someone from Don`s research team can explain why Sudbury is not among the top 10 or if it would be had they conducted the research today(?)
Real, good luck in Sudbury! I plan to be there myself within 2-4 weeks.. (I live in Toronto)
Regards,
Neil
Thanks Neil, Good luck to you too.
Did you find a good real estate agent in the area yet?
we own a 93 suiter in Sudbury .. and rents are going up 35-50% on trunover ..
it is likely not in the Top 10 towns as it is based on nickel and a few other employers .. so higher risk .. a bit like Alberta .. So, Sudbury without nickel is like Edmonton without oilsands .. both great investment areas since both nickel and oilsands will be here for decades !
We checked the proven reserve for the 2 nickel mines in towns: over 30 years ! Good enough a time horizon for us !!
I live in Sudbury and have owned rental real estate for over twenty years. The market is cyclical and that is why REIN in its wisdom has chosen not to include it in the Ontario Top Ten. Thomas is correct however, if there were 15 cities to choose from I`m sure Sudbury would rank somewhere near twelve.
I currently hold 19 properties with 61 units and have offers on four more. I need to waive conditions on one of the properties this week it closes on August 31, if anyone is interested in a JV please let me know. It is a fourplex with a single family house in the same deal. Cash flow in Sudbury is phenominal at the present time and promises to continue for at least the next 10 years. I can provide details. The other three properties are a vtb and close on August 20, 25 and 29th.
One thing that hasn`t been taken into account when looking at whether a community`s economic viability warrants a top ten spot is the fact that both mining plants in Sudbury have been purchased by major players. INCO was purchased by Vale out of Brazil and Falconbridge was purchased by Xtrata out of Sweden. This allows for much more research and development thus more people and more job opportunities. China and the Asian block are huge purchaser`s of Nickel and Sudbury is the worlds major supplier of Nickel, copper and other precious metals.
If anyone is interested in talking further about the Sudbury market and it`s potential I would be happy to meet with you in Toronto, Sudbury or wherever just let me know.
