Legal issue for condo

kreezo

New Forum Member
Registered
Hi,

If you have a 2br + Den condo, is it legal to convert the den into a bedroom to make it into a 3br unit? Is that legal?

Would the renter just sign a regular rental agreement as well? In case of a dispute, are you dealing with the same landlord-tenant relationships?

Chris
 

Aneta

Inspired Forum Member
REIN Member
I have only personal insight. I used to own and live in a condo in Mississauga, 1BR with a den. The condo corp rules stated that den could not be a bedroom and that the max occupancy per unit is to be 2 people per bedroom. There were people in the building that used a den as a bedroom. I did not know of any owner who was able to convert it legitimately to a bedroom. Such activity would have to be approved by management and condo board. I also know that many of the resales on MLS advertised den as a bedroom, which I thought was quite unprofessional of the agents.

I guess it comes down to how strict the condo board is, whether your conversion would be discovered and if you feel like being 100% honest. As an owner-occupant, I was annoyed at the overcrowding of the units with dens as bedrooms, I was paying the same maintenance fees per sq ft. As a landlord, that may work out better, you may be able to charge higher rent.
 

Thomas Beyer

Senior Forum Member
REIN Member
A den differs from a bedroom in 3 aspects:
a) it usually has no window
b) it usually has no closet
c) it usually is smaller

Check the provincial definition of a bedroom first .. then check the condo board rules (if any)

Assuming there is a window, then I would argue you CAN add a closet yourself and call it a bedroom if size is not an issue.

However, most developers are not dumb, so why would they not call it a bedroom in the first place ?
 

kreezo

New Forum Member
Registered
So whether you can rent out the den as a bedroom, legally or not, really depends on the condo corporation`s rules. If you use it as a bedroom what sort of procedures do you have to complete for the conversion? Cause if you had a SFD and you wanted to convert it into a duplex - you would have to change the licensing/zoning.

The reason why I asked was that the 2Br + Den unit I looked at will only cash flow with the den but I`m not sure if thats a feasible and sustainable strategy
 

Thomas Beyer

Senior Forum Member
REIN Member
a 4th issue (besides window, size and closet) to consider is PARKING as a non-bedroom requires no add`l parking. So a 2BR + den may require 1 stall but a 3BR may require 2 stalls .. this maybe a condo corp. requirement or a city by-law or a provincial law.

Next step: phone city hall, and aks for the planning department. They are not very busy these days due to a lack of new construction.

They can advise you re "den vs. bedroom" in that specific project as the zoning requirements 2 blocks over may be different due to zoning and by-laws.
 

Aneta

Inspired Forum Member
REIN Member
QUOTE (thomasbeyer2000 @ May 1 2009, 03:00 PM) a 4th issue (besides window, size and closet) to consider is PARKING as a non-bedroom requires no add`l parking. So a 2BR + den may require 1 stall but a 3BR may require 2 stalls .. this maybe a condo corp. requirement or a city by-law or a provincial law.

Next step: phone city hall, and aks for the planning department. They are not very busy these days due to a lack of new construction.

They can advise you re "den vs. bedroom" in that specific project as the zoning requirements 2 blocks over may be different due to zoning and by-laws.

I would start with talking to the condo corp before taking time to make calls or going see the municipality. If you sense they are strongly against the idea, I would look elsewhere for deals, instead wasting time fighting against it. Toronto also has the additional Land Transfer Tax, which seriously hinders a cash flow situation (ie. you could put that extra money into downpayment or use it in your rental reserve fund instead of making it disappear).
 

housingrental

Frequent Forum Member
Registered
If this is a newer condo it`s likely a lower sq ft unit.. likely den doesn`t meet building code standard of minimum square footage (along with possible window issue re Thomas post and other issues re other post).... I think but I`m not certain in Ontario it`s 65 sq ft with access to closet and 75 sqft with no closet access
 
Top