Potential Tenants

[housingrental]

Ed - Agreed. Be very diligent in checking income (source / length / stability) and references. Get your realtor to verify claimed owner is actual owner through registry.

QUOTE (jwilbrin @ Jun 10 2009, 05:30 PM) The guy who is helping them may want to meet you to see if you are trustworthy orrrr..... Maybe HE DOESN`T TRUST HER and wants to make sure the money is being used for rent and not something else. Based on the info I`ve read in these posts I`m guessing the latter.

Ed, I would really give serious consideration to the information and advice the folks participating in this discussion have given you. I think most would agree this one has huge potential to end very badly. She may have last months and part of June but what about Aug., Sept., Oct...? Will she have rent for those months or just more elaborate stories. As entertaining as this saga has been, I would hate to see more posts on her excuses in the future because you`ve decided to rent to her. You`re better off with a vacancy and waiting for the right tenant than rushing into renting to this woman.

 

[NeilUttamsingh]

I can honestly say that this one thread is worth more than my annual REIN membership...or at least the thread has helped me to SAVE more than that!

Here is the latest on the `Bridge Lady`. (because she will be living under the aforementioned bridge)

I have had the pleasure of receiving 5 telephone calls from her today, 2 voicemails and one e-mail. None of which I have responded to.

Ed, or anyone else, if there is any doubt still in your head about this lady... now hear this...

As previously mentioned in this thread, this woman is a compulsive liar. She could not even keep straight her lies with me today as she was leaving various messages...

First she called me to tell me (in a voicemail) that her friend was willing to provide her with first and last month, and that she wanted to meet tomorrow.

In a subsequent voice mail, she called me to tell her that her dad was willing to provide her with the first and last month rent.

If this experience has taught me anything, it has taught me to look past people`s BS. Treat your real estate investments like a business, and don`t be a sucker!

 

[AndyLuchies]

Send this subject post to anyone questioning a rein membership. Worth every penny.

EXCELLENT WEBSITE- the `do not rent` one. I assumed it couldn`t be done as anyone on the list could sue for public defamation or whatever its called.
that list is going on my favorites. (hopefully people don`t have common names....remember the Don Campbell story, I hate to reject a renter because her name is the same as the bridge-lady`s!)

 

[JoefromTO]

I feel so left out...I want to be in the "In" group of people getting these phone calls. I was thinking of creating a false advertisment in Hamilton hoping that she will call me too

All kidding aside, great thread!

 

[invst4profit]

QUOTE (jessandy @ Jun 10 2009, 09:53 PM) Send this subject post to anyone questioning a rein membership. Worth every penny.

EXCELLENT WEBSITE- the `do not rent` one. I assumed it couldn`t be done as anyone on the list could sue for public defamation or whatever its called.
that list is going on my favorites. (hopefully people don`t have common names....remember the Don Campbell story, I hate to reject a renter because her name is the same as the bridge-lady`s!)


There are actually many existing "bad tenant" lists. The "terminator`s" web site has a list as well as many local LL groups. I believe there is also a web site for the TO area that has a posted list as well that members may add to.

 

[RandyDalton]

QUOTE (EdRenkema @ Jun 10 2009, 05:11 PM) Thanks Greg, I already did a credit check and its not good, but most of my tenants have bad credit, that`s why they are tenants. The last one I rented to will never own a home, but are good tenants that pay on time. This one has issues in 05 & 06 where they paid late or not at all. The previous LLs, I called both and both gave her a good reference.
I will go even further and ask for more confirmation.


Like I said before, curiosity (that killed the cat I know) would get the better of me. I would want to put this to bed once and for all. Take the existing landlord out for coffee, or lunch, or whatever (he will be more open to discussion and you know he wont be distracted on a face to face versus a phone call). Find out why he is evicting her and tell him all that you know. See what he has to say. Like Greg said, maybe she is just scatter brained. Maybe everyone here is correct. Rather than us all guessing I would want to know from the person who probably knows her best. But then again, it depends on your personal situation and time availability.

Only my two cents...Randy D.

 

[EdRenkema]

QUOTE (RandyDalton @ Jun 11 2009, 06:36 AM) Like I said before, curiosity (that killed the cat I know) would get the better of me. I would want to put this to bed once and for all. Take the existing landlord out for coffee, or lunch, or whatever (he will be more open to discussion and you know he wont be distracted on a face to face versus a phone call). Find out why he is evicting her and tell him all that you know. See what he has to say. Like Greg said, maybe she is just scatter brained. Maybe everyone here is correct. Rather than us all guessing I would want to know from the person who probably knows her best. But then again, it depends on your personal situation and time availability.

Only my two cents...Randy D.


She has called me again today saying she has recent cheque stubs and last year`s T4 and has once again given me her employer`s phone # and extension. I called, no answer, voicemail and no return call. Her current LL is also not returning my calls.

 

[invst4profit]

Have you confirmed that the Tel# is actually a business? How long has she worked there?

It is very difficult to not believe this person is up to something. She is trying way too hard to please. This is usually a very good tip off to a professional tenant. They often come across as the nicest people in the world until they are a tenant.
Who voluntarily offers there T4 to a LL?
Did her previous landlord appear to be sincere? Were you sure they are in fact a landlord?

What are the circumstances behind her moving from her present unit?

 

[Savard]

We place no value on a reference from a previous landlord.

My story is that I lied to a prospective landlord to get a tenant out of my place. They got the place and I got vacant possession.


A few years ago, at the actual top of the market, we were trying to sell a house. The lease was up for the tenants who occupied the house. They were on hard times and were having a tough time finding a new place. We allowed them to overhold (paying their rent of course). A few days that turned into a few weeks and turned into 2 months. They are quite nice people but could not figure out their finances.

As mentioned we tried to sell this house. In that time period a lessor house sold for $256k. We chased the market down and have since gone back to renting it out. Current market is $185k.

Make sure you know the motivation of the people that you deal with.

On a different topic. We get very few requests for references and have had hundreds of tenants. Not sure why this is?

 

[EdRenkema]

QUOTE (invst4profit @ Jun 11 2009, 08:47 AM) Have you confirmed that the Tel# is actually a business? How long has she worked there?

It is very difficult to not believe this person is up to something. She is trying way too hard to please. This is usually a very good tip off to a professional tenant. They often come across as the nicest people in the world until they are a tenant.
Who voluntarily offers there T4 to a LL?
Did her previous landlord appear to be sincere? Were you sure they are in fact a landlord?

What are the circumstances behind her moving from her present unit?

Quick update, I did successfully contact her employment and her supervisor confirmed her income and that she has been employed there for 2 yrs. Yes it is a business # since the outgoing message which I`ve listened to several times confirms that and I had to go through several people to actually get to her supervisor.
She is providing the T4 because I asked for it along with the cheque stubs, simply for me to confirm employment and income.
Her previous LL did appear sincere and on initial contact I simply asked if she had an apartment for rent and she answered no she did not have a vacancy but was a landlord.

She is moving from her current house because the LL is selling and moving out of town. This was confirmed by that LL in our initial conversation.

 

[invst4profit]

Interesting.
Is her LL selling or sold? Why would that prompt her move, is vacancy possibly part of the sale agreement because she is a bad tenant and the LL does not want to kill the deal if she dosn`t move.

Or is all of this simply coincidence.

Maybe we were mistaken about her being a professional tenant although she did portray all the tell tale signs. Still too soon to tell.
She may still be high risk due to poor money management skills and other "issues".
Difficult to predict how she would interact with other tenants.

I normally would rejected her type from the get go there by avoiding having to make a final judgement call.
At this stage you may ultimately have to go with your gut. Not a pleasant thought.

Good luck

 

[JoefromTO]

I have a general question for Hamilton property owners. When you have a vacancy, how many calls do you get from potential applicants?

I get the impression that there is an abundance of product available with few applicants. I base this opinion on all the responses from REIN members who have posted here. So my impression is that there are other members with vacancies and all are getting calls from the same woman.

Are you not receiving other calls and if you are, are the applicants less than desireable?

 

[NeilUttamsingh]

invst4proft - There is no mistaking. This is a professional tennant.
JoefromTO - Currently, and espcecially though Kijiji, there are numerous people contacting me to rent, however, the majority of them either have poor credit, or they are looking outside of their price range. (Mostly people looking outside of their price range) I don`t think that there is too much inventory on the market right now in Hamilton, I have found that people`s decision making process has slowed down a bit. People are very tentative, and are not jumping to rent the first place that they see. (I could be wrong...just my thoughts)

Ed - be careful.

I am convinced that the previous LL contact that she provided was a friend.

Let me recap her (Bridge Lady`s) most noteworthy lies to date.

1) The same day that I am reviewing her rental application and checking her credit, she is conversing with you as well. She tells me that she can provide half of first month`s rent, and cannot produce last months. She says that since her current LL is going to be out of town June 12 through 16, the move out inspection is going to be done upon her return. As such, she says that she is going to have the last months 5 days after she moves out of her current place.

On the same day, she tells you that she had her purse stolen from a park bench. She put it down, and then it was gone... In the purse she had $1500 that was intended for another landlord. She also tells you that she is not going to get her last months back from her LL until 30 days after she moves out.

2) She says that she now has a friend that is going to provide her with the first and last month`s rent.
She tells me this in a voicemail yesterday. On the same day, she says that the person that is going to provide her with the first and last is her dad (can she not keep track of her lies?)



She texted me today at 6:54am and has called me twice since. I hope that after not returning her 7 calls, 2 voicemails, one e-mail, and one text in the last 2 days...she is getting the idea that I don`t want to rent to her, and don`t want to have anything to do with her!

 

[invst4profit]

[quote name=`Neil Uttamsingh` date=`Jun 11 2009, 02:52 PM` post=`59728`]invest4profit - There is no mistaking. This is a professional tennant.

I must of had a temporary lapse of judgement.
I am beginning to weaken.

Must be strong! MUST resist the temptation to fall under her spell.
I promise to review my collection of NSF checks tonight to strengthen my will to resist.

Ed. Please ignore my previous post I momentarily forgot I was in Ontario.

 

[mortgageman]

This thread and Ed`s screening process is such a good case study that it would almost be a shame if Ed didn`t rent to her so we could find out if she was indeed a deadbeat tenant. Too bad there`s real money at stake, the potential for her to cause serious stress in his life and the potential damage to the property.
Ed, I`d play it safe and not rent to her. There are way too many red flags. I see in your member photo you`ve got a child in your life. Real estate investing is supposed to provide you more time with your kids, not cause head aches that rob you of time with them and cause you to be grumpy when you are with them.
All the best
Jason

 

[EdRenkema]

QUOTE (mortgageman @ Jun 11 2009, 02:28 PM) This thread and Ed`s screening process is such a good case study that it would almost be a shame if Ed didn`t rent to her so we could find out if she was indeed a deadbeat tenant. Too bad there`s real money at stake, the potential for her to cause serious stress in his life and the potential damage to the property.
Ed, I`d play it safe and not rent to her. There are way too many red flags. I see in your member photo you`ve got a child in your life. Real estate investing is supposed to provide you more time with your kids, not cause head aches that rob you of time with them and cause you to be grumpy when you are with them.
All the best
Jason


Sorry Jason, not my child, but nice try. That is my neice Bianca the cutest little girl in Calgary, she turns one year old next July 1st and I`ll just happen to be in town for the Edmonton Conference.

No reason not to play it safe though.
And I`m still getting calls.

 

[RebeccaBryan]

Out of your three choices in the original post the three young men were your best bet. I have rented to many young men that get together and come here to work in Alberta. These kids are chasing a dream of making big money and they are organized enough to leave home and take responsibility for their own lives. All the kids that are living off Mommy and Daddy are still at home. While I agree that sometimes one tenant changes their mind and the spot gets filled with another tenant, the rent gets paid and the property gets looked after. They are rental `virgins`and they are not likely to be professional tenants. If you do your due dilligence you will find that many of these kids come from good families and are young integral citizens. They are easy to teach and they usually follow the rules if you take the time to explain what is expected of them. Explanation of expectations are what wards off your foreseeable problems. I do not hesitate to rent to them as long as their stories check out, their credit check shows responsibility and I have a good feeling.

 

[RebeccaBryan]

May I also add that Potential Tenant Number 3 is a professional tenant. That is a typical Professional Tenant Story pulling at the heart strings of Landlords with money and compassion. If you rent and beleive these sob stories, it`s time to get a property manager. Hey, I am one of the most compassionate people you will ever meet, but I choose who I donate my time and money to and don`t appreciate when it is dictated to me.

 

[brad]

This nut started out by lying to you. To me that is strike 1, 2 and 3.

Just my 2 cents.

Brad

 

[JoeRagona]

QUOTE (brad @ Jun 11 2009, 11:14 PM) This nut started out by lying to you. To me that is strike 1, 2 and 3.

Just my 2 cents.

Brad


Exactly, take the advice of the experienced and move on. Put forth positive energy in finding a tenant that fits YOUR profile.